From Navy SEAL to AI Startup
A former Navy SEAL discusses his leap to the tech industry and how companies benefit from veterans’ experience
Zach Marshall is Head of Business Development at Accrete, a hot New York City AI startup. Prior to this, he was a decorated U.S. Navy SEAL Sniper and Freefall Jumpmaster before transitioning into leadership as a U.S. Navy SEAL Division Director. During his military career, he and his platoon received two Navy and Marine Corps Commendation Medals along with an Army Commendation Medal and Combat Action Ribbon for service performed in Afghanistan. We met to discuss how military veterans can transition into the tech startup world and what challenges they may have to overcome.
How did you discover your passion for tech?
I guess you could say it came backwards. It wasn’t “tech” first, it was “passionate teams” first. Coming from a very specialized, highly-motivated unit of the military meant as I transitioned from the military I was looking for the same thing in civilian life. I wanted to find small teams who were super dedicated to an outcome. It wasn’t going to be by working at a huge biotech company or in a cubicle somewhere. It was going to be somewhere where people were entrepreneurial and working together and solving problems creatively. Before I got out of the military I spent a good amount of time doing information interviews with people and finding out more about different sectors — management consulting, entrepreneurship through acquisition and startups, or venture-backed businesses. The positives drew me to venture-backed companies — people there are all experts and they are all passionate about their projects.
How long did it take you to find a new job?
It depends on how you look at it. It took me 18 months to find the job in tech, but I never missed a paycheck because I leveraged my program in the military to be working at my first job before I even got out.
Did you have to take any additional classes?
No, but I probably have a different story than a lot of other military people. When I first joined the Navy, I dropped out of college. I didn’t take any classes after I left, but I studied a ton. I studied for more than a year in order to get where I was. I needed to understand the industry, the vocabulary, and read both venture capital and organizational leadership books so that I could transfer my military leadership knowledge into the new vocabulary. Also, the mentors I ended up with — the really great people around me — they passed on so much knowledge.
Can you share more about your job search and interview process and also, how you chose the robotic company you worked for?
I attended a networking event in San Francisco and met a lot of great people. I was most impressed by a few different speakers and so I sought out those speakers and built relationships with them. During other networking dinners, I met with people that wanted to meet me, but I also met their spouses and friends that came along. Through that process, I ended up with four different interviews for four different job opportunities. Each one required a large amount of personal extra effort because coming out of the military, there’s just no direct translation to what I was going to do for a robotic company that has robots driving around delivering food. There’s no direct relationship between the military and being a senior business intelligence analyst for a trucking company. Each of these things required a lot of research, extra drive, and communication. If there’s one talent I have, it’s probably communication, where that might not generally be the case with military guys or women. My ability to persuade, mimic, and learn personalities quickly really helped me through the interview process.
I think the most interesting interview was actually with the job that I took. I got an introduction from a speaker at the conference. I met him through the speaking engagement, grabbed his email, followed up a couple of times, and pitched him a couple of ideas that I’d like to build and start. He recommended that I get a little experience first. He was right, I would have made a lot more mistakes if I were to start a company back then. He connected with the CEO of the company through a double opt-in and I had a 45-minute interview with her. Leaving the building that day, I was excited. I had a great conversation, but it was hard to see that I would be invited back to San Francisco, and so I put together an email that said “I really enjoyed our conversation, I know we’ve connected on a lot of things, but I’m not sure I’ve answered very well what value I would bring day one, so let me tell you exactly what I would do.” I went through each of the different departments that a company should have at the 30 employee stage, most of which the company didn’t yet have, and I described the first three to four steps that I would do for each of those and then how I would learn things I would need to learn for the job. That got me another interview. Because of my lack of experience, I also had to do a code challenge, but instead of programming, it was “write a few case studies, show me that you can write basic copy that sounds intelligent and interesting.”
You mentioned that your fellow military friends are struggling to find a job. What do you think is the biggest challenge for them?
It’s translating what they did in the military into how that’s useful in the civilian world. The people that I’m talking about are fighter pilots, bomb disposal professionals, and Navy SEALS. Part of their persona is not really talking specifically about what they do. But being able to tell your own story is incredibly important. The military has a very different evaluation system; in the civilian world, you have to describe what leadership is. I focused on showcasing stories from my career at large, not just from experience in a combat zone. For example, I built a curriculum and ran three and a half months of training events that were really high risk and had 70–80 people working for me at any given time. It was actually easy for me to translate that one, but many veterans have to work harder to find a story that translates.
It can be hard to figure out how leading a team of four people in a super austere high stakes environment translates into leading a team of 10–12 people in a startup. The other side is that officers or people who have led large groups have a hard time describing how their responsibilities weren’t just handed to them. In reality, there’s a massive amount of mentorship and learning that they have to do in order to become a leader and make good decisions. Even if at first they’re dealing with young soldiers getting into bar fights, by the time they are leaving the service they’re doing much more complicated tasks. Maybe they’ve built unique programs to adopt new technology into their unit or they’ve been in charge of the logistics of ridiculous amounts of gear flying all over the world. They actually invent ways to do these things. Communicating those things is tough for people.
Another barrier is that there are definitely misconceptions about military people from people who have never been a part of the military world, mostly because of TV. Not even every SEAL is the same, in fact, there’s a massive spectrum. There’s a huge array of performance and skill requirements and experience that military people have. Expert jobs generally require intelligence as well. Sometimes there’s a misconception that you can drop out of school and join the military and become a leader easily.
Ultimately, the way you’re able to perform and do really well past those first few years comes down to actual human capabilities. You don’t get told what to do all the time. You have to make decisions and learn and grow. A successful career in the SEALs requires extreme intelligence, focus, and discipline. The kind of discipline that requires you to spend however many hours it takes to make sure that whatever you’re doing is perfect, all the time.
Let’s talk about your first day at work. How was it difficult for you?
It was fun, but the more you learn the more you realize you know nothing. Day one, it was almost like an internship, I felt very junior, but also a little less stressed about my performance. I had to fight that off. Coming out of the military, I had to build up credibility with everybody. If you hire a programmer who says they have a certain skill, and they do a code challenge to prove it, they should have that skill when they show up. Even though I had certain skills the day that I showed, it took a long time to have people trust that.
Are there any books you would suggest for people making a transition from a military to a business career?
“Berkshire Hathaway Letters to Shareholders” by Warren Buffet was really interesting. Going through those letters will quickly shift your mind to something that’s very technical and real and you can learn a lot from them. It’s like a piece of an MBA. “Poor Charlie’s Almanac” is also great. I think the fact that I started by learning more about the finance piece and investing really helped me understand just how technical things can be. Podcasts are also awesome because you can hear the professionals and experts actually speaking the way they would and figure out what you like and what you don’t like and then dive deeper.
What would you say are the best jobs in tech for Navy veterans considering your training and skills?
The best-fit upfront is probably sales. We’re talking about extremely disciplined, hardworking people that like fighting for a goal. They haven’t ever made a ton of money, so sales can be really exciting for that, and they’re willing to learn and push hard. The negative side is you’re generally not team-oriented, as sales is pretty individual. Of the sample size that I have, probably half of the Navy SEALs that I know have gone into sales and been really successful. My guess would be that within one or two more job transitions they switch more to a manager or team role somewhere else, but it’s a really great way to get your feet wet. Also, a chief of staff or project management role could be a great fit. If companies are able to match with a military operator who can take their extreme professionalism and executive presence and put that in the boardroom with a CEO or COO they can learn from they’ll be able to crush any project that person gives them. Then after one chief of staff role they can go into a more specialized route — sales, recruiting, or other functions.
Why do you think technology companies should look at hiring veterans?
When you find a military veteran and have a good hire, you’re automatically going to get a level of passion, dedication, and attention to detail you won’t get anywhere else. You’re going to get mission-oriented people. Especially with technology companies that are growing, the mission is almost everything. You need to have a mission and a group mission. I think military members are predisposed to want to fight for a mission.
Are there any organizations or meetups that help veterans find jobs?
Absolutely, one organization is called Elite Meet. It’s a non-profit founded by a former Wall Street investor and a Navy SEAL. They host conferences in different cities and different local chapters host other meetings. Warrior Rising is a non-profit that focuses on military veterans transitioning to entrepreneurs. For the same reasons military members are great employees, they’re also great entrepreneurs. Warrior Rising has a training pipeline course, hosts online webinars, and helps veterans link up with mentors. These organizations can also help you find funding and give grants to help start your company. They can also help you build a business plan. They’re the only one that I know of that gives non-equity funding to military vets to help them start businesses.
You have led some meetups yourself, can you please elaborate on this?
I’ve now hosted quite a few unofficial Elite Meet events, to connect the network that we already have here in San Francisco with other professionals. The idea is to see who needs help and see if we can bring value to each other, but also it opens the door to invite other people in. Maybe they can meet people they can hire or address other needs. One organization, SEAL Future Foundation, started by helping veterans transition into education. Now they continue to help with education, but they also help with placement because they have a huge network of professionals. They also have a wellness portion, which focuses on each person’s specific wellness needs as they leave. They’re an awesome organization, it almost feels like a family. They’ll follow up forever and help you with the kind of treatments that aren’t covered by the VA or regular medicare.
If I want to bring military veterans to my company, where should I be looking?
I think reaching out to different organizations is a really good first step. Those organizations are going to want to talk to you and there are a ton of organizations that do that. The three I previously mentioned are all non-profit, but there are a few really great for-profit firms as well. Shift.org and Breakline are two organizations that put veterans in front of you. There’s LinkedIn as well, but one thing all recruiters should know is that a veteran is going to be predisposed to think they’re being taken advantage of. When you’re leaving the military you know you’re part of this generalized group and there are a lot of people who make money off of your transition, whether it’s to help you write a resume or whatever. Recruiters should bring value first, before asking for anything, and work with veteran organizations.
If a military veteran would like to make a transition but sees a job posting that says it requires five-plus years of experience, would they apply for that job?
Most people won’t. Many military members read job descriptions and think they don’t qualify because they don’t have the exact level of experience mentioned. From my experience, a lot of those requirements aren’t necessary when you come from a military background. Anybody hiring a 10-year Navy SEAL or fighter pilot is getting somebody who has proven themselves for a long period of time. If you are talking to veterans, I would consider modifying your job description in a way that communicates to them, such as “If you are a veteran who knows you can accomplish the key tasks that we list in the description, give us a call even though your experience may be different.”
When a company wants to hire a military veteran, what should they know?
Both sides should know that when there’s a really good match it might feel like everything has already worked out, but that’s not really true yet. Being in a military organization and being in a civilian organization might as well be on two different planets. There has to be an understanding with military veterans that they’re ready to learn and probably already more than qualified to do the tasks they need to do. Whatever onboarding that does have to occur will probably be different. More communication is better, more feedback early on could be really effective in helping them to move forward. Examples include asking them, “Hey, how did you get feedback at your command? How did you actually change your behavior? How did you learn? How did you do everything when you were there?” We’re not used to the ways that these evaluations happen, or how one-on-ones happen. A lot of things that happen in the military, the things that really matter, are less official. The official evaluations are very systematic. The real stuff happens in conversation. There’s definitely a transition between the two.
What are the key questions to ask veterans and what’s off-limits? What advice can you give to recruiters and hiring managers?
Step one is to make sure you’re not asking questions that are illegal to be asking. I don’t think anything would have been off-limits talking to me, but I think it’s important to communicate if you’re going to ask questions about specific experiences. Say things like “Don’t tell me if you don’t want to tell me.” You wouldn’t ever say something like, “Oh, you were a sniper? How many people did you kill?” That’s not something that would relate to the work or the role. You should ask questions to help guide that person into making a connection between their experience and the roles you’re trying to fill.
